I choke every time I say that Henry loved Anne, but I truly want to believe he felt something.   I guess I would call it a magnificent obsession.  A great passion if you will. I have read the love letters and I find them very romantic.  Maybe Henry talked himself into believing he was in love with Anne, and he had to have her.  Then he talked himself into believing he hated her, and had to get rid of her.  His passion dissipated, and his obsession was placed elsewhere.

From all the things I have read of Henry and Anne's courtship, I think it might have been one of those “Endless Love” things – where he was obssessed with her, and had to have her at all costs, only to find, for whatever reasons he might have had, that the pursuit was where all the excitement was.

Here, he finally had her, after all those years of striving to get her into bed, and it wasn't a life changing experience after all. While a fascinating, intelligent, sexy woman, Anne WAS a woman, just like any other he had had.

The difference was her novelty – she dared say “no,” when he first proposed she become his official mistress.

LOL, can the rest of you imagine how rich a psychiatrist could have become, trying to help Henry through all of his “issues” with women? Marriage counselors would have had a field day! Not to mention, divorce lawyers might have bankrupted England, with regards to custody and inheritance rights for Mary and Elizabeth, as well as whatever alimony Katharine of Aragon and Anne would have been entitled to after putting up with all of his nonsense.

Nikki08 said:

What man will behead the woman he loves(d)? Seems beyond human capacity to do that……

Not only did he behead her….but he married Jane the next day!! And then proceeded to marry 3 other women…..he mourned Jane more than he did Anne…..he could have sent Anne to a nunnery or have her agree to annull the marriage…I mean, she signed the paper hrs before her death to save her daughter's life..I'm sure she would have signed the same paper to save her own life…..if he loved her, he would have just divorced her like he did Katherine…..

First up, in 16th century England the death penalty could be bestowed upon adulterous wives, the mandatory sentence being burning, just as men could beat their wives to within an inch of their lives, with impunity. I feel you are judging Henry by modern standards.

Henry and Anne were married for over three years, not a few months. The marriage got off to a pretty good start, and  were very happy together. However, over time Henry's love for Anne died. Henry had torn apart the country so that he could marry her. Once the love began to die, Henry came to realise the full implications of what he had done. He had exposed his Kingdom to the threat of invasion, alienated his subjects and it dawned upon him that no one outside England regarded his daughter Elizabeth as a legitimate heir (ruling her out of the valuable marriage market).There were other things, too.

About the execution. Henry could not afford to repeat his last mistakes. Until January 1536, there were essentially two Queens in England. Katherine of Aragon and Anne Boleyn (with the vast majority of the country rooting for Katherine, a minority rooting for Anne). This was dividing the people of England and was a potential starting point for civil war (the thing Henry feared most). If Henry simply annulled his marraige to Anne, and Jane replaced her; there would once again be two Queens, dividing the nation and people questioning the legitimacy of the consort's issue. Henry could not take the risk, he desparately needed a male heir.

There were murmers of discontent over the rapidity with which Henry married Jane, following Anne's execution. Thats' perfectly understandable, however Henry was no longer a young man and he had no time to lose.

I'm certain that Henry did love Anne. I think he loved her passionately. It's just that, the love died and Henry's hatred of Anne matched his former love for her.

Henry marrying three other women and making as issue of it, is judging Henry  with hindsight. Henry had no idea that he would marry several more times after Anne. He had no idea that Jane would die shortly after Edward's birth and if there was anything he could've done to prevent that, he would have.

Anne of Cleves was an arranged marraige, and no one could've prevented the disaster that that turned into.

Katherine Howard, well the least said about that, the better! There is no fool like an old fool, as they say.

Katherine Parr was finally a good marraige to a good woman.

Read up on the subject, and it all makes sense in the end.

Nikki08 said,

I am currently 'reading up on the subject', and I wonder if continuing to read various versions of the story with the same outcome will make the whole murder make more sense? Afterall…..I think that the reason a lot of people are sympathetic and interested in Anne is because of the unfair hand she was dealt in the end…..jmo…..

I could be wrong, of course…there have been a LOT of people defending(explaining) Henry's decision to have Anne killed….and I don't think one person has said that he was in the wrong..so maybe I'm wrong to think so negatively of him for his decision….

But the reasons you brought up…I dunno…I can't see Henry really caring about effect his decisions had on those entities you mentioned(other countries invading, others thinking that Elizabeth was illegititmate[remember, he still had Mary], etc)….but maybe the books I've read so far aren't doing HIM justice….I'll keep reading….

Nikki08….I have been reading about this for years and my feelings haven't changed one bit.  I don't like Henry.  Never did.  The man was a murderer.  However, I do try to understand what the hell he was thinking.  I have yet to come up with a good reason why he did what he did. 

He certainly had some kind of warm feeling for Anne.  I still say it was an obsessive passion.  I have a hard time understanding how someone who claims to love someone so deeply, can fall out of love so quickly.  Before I married my husband, I fell in and out of love…I'll just say…often enough.  I was so wrong.  I was not in love at all.  Passion, yes! Even one obsession! (both of which are fine, make me smile, memories) They were real, but they were definitely not love as I know it to be.  Love IMHO lasts forever and only gets deeper as time goes on.  It cannot die.  You cannot kill it.  If I were a Queen, I would never be able to kill my husband.  (BTW, I am a Queen in my house… er…castle.) 

So I can't get into believing that Henry TRULY loved Anne. He certainly can't prove it by me.  If he had loved her, I mean truly loved her, I don't believe he would have ever let himself believe the false lies Cromwell used to bring his “beloved” down.  He would never have approved the investigation.  He wanted out! There is just no way a person who really, truly loves another person would ever have allowed any of those charges to come to light.  He was King for heaven's sake.  He could have shut the case down before it even began. 

I've said it before and I'll say it again, Henry was a spoiled brat.  I think he searched his whole life for love, and every time he had it within his grasp, he sabatogued it.

No sticking up for the guy here!

As far as judging him using todays standards…..well, certainly today he can get a divorce for $195….lol….I was judging the severity of the punishment for someone he loved and was fully aware that she did not commit adultery…I don't buy that he thought she did….I think he was too arrogant at that time, to think a woman would…I think he thought HE could follow his wandering eye…

So having said that, I still think that beheading her was severe…even for those times…for a woman he loved and KNEW was being railroaded

But the reasons you brought up…I dunno…I can't see Henry really caring about effect his decisions had on those entities you mentioned(other countries invading, others thinking that Elizabeth was illegititmate

Beheading was regarded as merciful for the times, after all the mandatory sentence was burning. A much worse fate. Henry even went so far as to order an expert swordsman from France. Another merciful step. As I said earlier, adulterous wives could be executed.

As for whether Henry believed Anne was innocent. I am not too sure about that, we cannot say with certainty one way or the other. However, Henry spoke to his illegitimate son (Henry Fitzroy, Duke of Richmond) shortly before Anne's execution and broke down in tears. He said Anne had “had to do with over a hundred men, and that he (Fitzroy) and Mary had done well to escape Anne, as she planned to poison them”. This is in one of Chapuys letters, and shows that Henry believed in Anne's guilt.

Ofcourse Elizabeth's illegitimacy was a problem. If all other European monarchs refused to betroth their sons to her, it effectively removed Elizabeth from the lucrative marraige market, rendering another daughter useless. Marraiges were used to form international alliances, after all.  You say Henry still had Mary, but that misses the point. Mary was regarded by all as being Henry's “legitimate” daughter, so she could be used in marital alliances if Henry had so desired. But Henry couldn't lose face like that, and Anne would have been furious.

Henry's greatest fears were foriegn invasion and civil war. So yes, that defiantely played a part in his actions. Ofcourse he cared about it and I find your disregard of it perplexing, to be honest. And Henry did risk a foriegn invasion, by the Emperor (Katherine of Aragon's nephew) amongst others.

As for Anne joining a nunnery, like I said. Two potential Queens dividing the nation is now what Henry wanted. He did annul the marraige, but we are not sure on what grounds.

Jasmine, excellent post. One problem, however. While your reasoning is sound, that thanks to the annullment prior to her execution, Anne was never truly Henry's wife, and could not have been an adulterer.

The problem here is your argument is rational, and I don't think Henry had any idea what “reason,” “reasonable,” “logical,” “sound,” or “rational” meant at this point.

It's very possible, thanks to his fall from the horse in that joust, where he was unconscious for something like two hours, that Henry suffered a traumatic brain injury, and as a result, his personality shifted, radically.