Boleyn said:

This is also true, there could be no way back for Anne she was going to die and that was the end of the matter as far as she and everyone else was concerned, so perhaps the carrot that may have been offered she knew was rubbish.

Even so I do feel that she was offered it, (all this talk of carrots is making me feel hungry). If she had of taken it and purely hypothetical speak here and Henry did repreive her life that would have been between him, Anne and Cromwell, and I'm sure that she would have been spirited away sometime in the night, and a story would have been put about that she had either died at her own hand or had died whilst trying to escape, nobody would have been none the wiser and both Henry and Cromwell would have gone to their graves with the secret..However like I said this is a purely hypotheical situation..But things did happen that simply had no explaination other than the ones given out before,- during and after Tudor times.. The Princes in the Tower, Henry 6th death, and Thomas Overbury's death (although Thomas's murder was questioned and the culprits punished another story and another mystery for another time) but to name just 3 So Anne Boleyn's disappearence from the Tower and from history wouldn't have been questioned, anymore than the Prince's Disappearence or Henry 6th death was. And it is only recently that imformation has come to light to prove what happened to both these mysteries, again 2 more mysteries for another time…

I personally believe that Cromwell invented the charges to save his own skin, and with the poisoning of Henry against Anne by Jane Seymour and her faction, Henry believed the charges. Therefore I don't think Anne's freedom was an option. Henry was obsessed with Anne, their relationship was unhealthy, but very passionate. I think if Anne was removed somewhere secret, Henry would have gone back to her eventually. They would always be drawn to one another. Most likely after a few years with Jane, boring and uninteresting to say the least, he would have longed for Anne again. Henry went in cycles with his wives, in his case I believe the grass was always greener.

Elliemarianna said:

Boleyn said:

This is also true, there could be no way back for Anne she was going to die and that was the end of the matter as far as she and everyone else was concerned, so perhaps the carrot that may have been offered she knew was rubbish.

Even so I do feel that she was offered it, (all this talk of carrots is making me feel hungry). If she had of taken it and purely hypothetical speak here and Henry did repreive her life that would have been between him, Anne and Cromwell, and I’m sure that she would have been spirited away sometime in the night, and a story would have been put about that she had either died at her own hand or had died whilst trying to escape, nobody would have been none the wiser and both Henry and Cromwell would have gone to their graves with the secret..However like I said this is a purely hypotheical situation..But things did happen that simply had no explaination other than the ones given out before,- during and after Tudor times.. The Princes in the Tower, Henry 6th death, and Thomas Overbury’s death (although Thomas’s murder was questioned and the culprits punished another story and another mystery for another time) but to name just 3 So Anne Boleyn’s disappearence from the Tower and from history wouldn’t have been questioned, anymore than the Prince’s Disappearence or Henry 6th death was. And it is only recently that imformation has come to light to prove what happened to both these mysteries, again 2 more mysteries for another time…

I personally believe that Cromwell invented the charges to save his own skin, and with the poisoning of Henry against Anne by Jane Seymour and her faction, Henry believed the charges. Therefore I don’t think Anne’s freedom was an option. Henry was obsessed with Anne, their relationship was unhealthy, but very passionate. I think if Anne was removed somewhere secret, Henry would have gone back to her eventually. They would always be drawn to one another. Most likely after a few years with Jane, boring and uninteresting to say the least, he would have longed for Anne again. Henry went in cycles with his wives, in his case I believe the grass was always greener.

Yes I think you are right.. Cromwell was without a doubt a very vindictive and spitefu and ambitious man, but I also get the opinion that he was also a bit of a coward, and because he had Henry's ear, he was able to hide under his skirts, if that makes sence. Anne Boleyn could see him for what he was, and that was perhaps the reason why he so vehemently turned against her, although I think at the start he tried to curry favour with her, again I think that was for personal gain. I also feel that if Anne had been spirirted away to a secret location I think it would have been Cromwell's men who would have killed her, He couldn't take the risk of Henry getting involved again with Anne as this would have put pay to his long term plans. This is purely an opinion, so don't slam me..

 Personally I also think that when he arranged the match with AOC. and I think he was to recieve a terratory in Cleves and a few other bits and bobs from the Duke of Cleves for arranging the match. He would have somehow retired and gone and been a King (and I use the term King loosely) in his own castle. A little bit like the nursery rhyme, the King was in his counting house counting out his money etc. Of course that all backfired when Anne wasn't how even he thought she was. Without the benefits that we have now, reports were taken as sacrosanct, and Anne was obvisously described as more beautiful than she actually was. But then what we consider beautiful today could be considered as ugly back then and vice versa. And as I said in a previous posting due to the fact of the fact that Cromwell had been offered as above, he could have bent Holbien's arm a little to make sure he painted something that Henry would like.   

Yes again I agree that Henry always did think the grass was greener only to discover that he had made a mistake the grass was perhaps greener but very bitter in taste. Henry was all for the thrill of the chase.. Henry's relationship with Anne was passionate but I also feel it was destructive too, for both of them. It was a bit like a love/hate relationship. I think that if Anne had been in a secret location, he would have still have visited her whomever he was married to. She would become his mistress en tisse instead of his wife. I think perhaps her death was the reason to why he became such a tyrant, as he simply couldn't and wouldn't get over it..

I did have another thought last night, to why Henry's behaviour was so irasible and tyranical after Anne death.. He had several illnesses or I should say suspected illnesses, taking out his infected leg etc, when he was knocked unconcious in his jousting event, and couldn't be awoken for a few hours, is it just possible that his mind was affected, something like a cerebal stroke? Callgula, was an ok bloke until he contracted some wierd illness, and when he finally pulled himself together, he was a very different person, and no one could dare break wind through fear of being killed.. I'm not saying that Henry was like Callgula, far from it no one could be that bad ever. But you must admit that Henry certainly was different. In his youth he was a kindly King, who was just and merciful. After his fall and after Anne death, he was a very changed man..

Mya Elise said:

Exactly, Cromwell may have been told to do something about Anne from Henry but I think everything else was completely Cromwell’s idea. I don’t think Henry ever stopped thinking about Anne after her death, he may not of mentioned her or used her fate in arguments but I have a strong feeling that the old King never got over Anne. And Anne wasn’t the type of woman you can get over with a snap of your fingers.

Oh, I certainly hope you are right, Mya.  I hope Henry never got Anne out of his head.  Elizabeth must have reminded Henry of Anne everytime he looked at her.  I cherish the thought. 

Sharon said:

Mya Elise said:

Exactly, Cromwell may have been told to do something about Anne from Henry but I think everything else was completely Cromwell's idea. I don't think Henry ever stopped thinking about Anne after her death, he may not of mentioned her or used her fate in arguments but I have a strong feeling that the old King never got over Anne. And Anne wasn't the type of woman you can get over with a snap of your fingers.

Oh, I certainly hope you are right, Mya.  I hope Henry never got Anne out of his head.  Elizabeth must have reminded Henry of Anne everytime he looked at her.  I cherish the thought. 

I think that is why perhaps Elizabeth wasn't at court that much, as she inhererited her mother's spark as well as her eyes. If that makes sence, although in some respects I also think Henry saw a lot of himself in her too, the old Henry this is, not what he'd become, and perhaps it was all too much for him to handle. Both sides of the same coin in one person. Although he never said it so this is my opinion, I think he must have truely loved and been extremely proud of Elizabeth, and perhaps knew that she would make one hell of a Queen, when the time came. Yeah you are right about Anne she was certianly an unforgetable person.. I mean look at us over 500 years later she is and always will be an icon to people. Her dark eyes have captured us all. Henry I think called her a dark eyed witch.

Mya Elise said:

Sharon said:

Mya Elise said:

Exactly, Cromwell may have been told to do something about Anne from Henry but I think everything else was completely Cromwell’s idea. I don’t think Henry ever stopped thinking about Anne after her death, he may not of mentioned her or used her fate in arguments but I have a strong feeling that the old King never got over Anne. And Anne wasn’t the type of woman you can get over with a snap of your fingers.

Oh, I certainly hope you are right, Mya.  I hope Henry never got Anne out of his head.  Elizabeth must have reminded Henry of Anne everytime he looked at her.  I cherish the thought. 

 

Yeah it gives me some hope : ) – And actually remember the part in The Tudors when Henry goes to Hever to see AOC and Elizabeth and when she curtseys he gives her a very odd look? It made me think that he was remembering Anne and it made him…happy (?).

 

@Boleyn, my real first name is Amara then my middle name is Elise but for years my nickname has been Mya so it has kind of stuck and now everyone calls me it. My 3 siblings also have uncommon names: Aubrianna, Ashton, & Alec (my mother likes unusual A names…LOL). I think Pia is a pretty and simple name, and also unusual.

Strangely enough now your've said it Amara is a beautiful name, but from what little I've picked up from your comments about your personality Mya suits you better. My name is unusual well it might be in the States, it's Lorna, but over here it's becomming quite popular, and it's very popular in Scotland as it is a Scottish name.

I agree about that look in TheTudors, I sort of liken it to the look that he gave when he first saw Anne in the Ray Winstone version of Henry 8th.. almost like a fire had lit up inside him..

Mya Elise said:

I actually have never liked my actual name, I like the meaning though (Eternal). I’ve always liked Mya because it’s easier for people to pronouce and Mya also has a cool meaning (Rebel). People always pronounce Amara wrong LOL, they say Ah-Mare as in a horse-Ah, when it’s actually Ah-Mar as in the planet Mars-Ah (Ah-Mar-Ah).

LOL, Yeah I think you have got a bit of a Rebel in you too..Mya suits you just nicely.. But I still think you have a K.Pin you too, dependable, solid, and down to earth, but also likes to have fun too, so perhaps not quite so staid as K.P.

The thing is it's woman like Anne who have taught us that. Before then it was a case of put up and shut up. A woman's role (in a man's eyes) was to have babies, and basically put up with the man having affairs etc.

Anne was a fun loving woman whose whole attitude literely changed the world, she showed woman that there was more to life than just having babies. Elizabeth inhereited that spark as I said.. She showed all the doubters that A woman was as good as any man to rule England. Mary had totally messed up England in short she'd left us broke. Elizabeth left this country safe secure and wealthy. In short she ruled as a man would have done. But Elizabeth had something else too she knew how to have fun too. Henry and Anne were a very dangerous combination, a little bit like Dynamite and a match, but together they made something which was perfect.

Dynamite and a match sleeping together created a lovely little explosion. And a queen was born. Beautiful.