wreckmasterjay said:

I have loads on Richard Speck and Manson, I started reading true crime when I was 15 and the West murders were all over the papers, since then I have dreamed of being someone who tracks down the lost and finds the bad guys etc. (probably why I write books now and still apply to join the police now and again!)

Speaking of bad guys, have the books been closed on the Jack the Ripper case?  This one has always intrigued me.  I have read many theories, but was never sold on one.  I haven't read about him in years.  Kind of gave up.  I was obsessing.

Of all the killers I've read about, Speck, Bundy, Gacey, etc., Manson is the one I despise the most.  I think because he had such a power over those girls, his so-called “family.”  And he's still alive. 

I always thought a private eye would have been a great occupation. 

Bella44 said:

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I don't think they've ever drawn firm conclusions about Jack the Ripper, which is probably why he attracts so many conspiracy theorists, LOL.  Have to admit though, I do enjoy watching TV shows about the whole case – the dark underbelly of Victorian London has always exerted a weird fascination for me and next time I go to London I'd really like to do one of those terrible Jack the Ripper tours, if they still have them!

At the moment I'm reading Elizabeth Norton's bio on Catherine Parr.  The weird thing about Norton is that she gets better (I think!) with each book; her first one on Anne I just didn't think much of quite frankly but the ones on Jane Seymour and Anne of Cleves were far better!

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The Jack the Ripper case has fascinated me for years. Oh and Bella — I did one of those Ripper tours when I first went to England in 2000. It wasn't the one they normally advertise everywhere — it was one conducted by a gentleman who was a full-time Beefeater! He was actually very good, and always made sure that the group stayed together and that stragglers caught up. I remember him telling us how the area had changed, and in some ways how it was very similar. We went to every spot where a victim was discovered or had been seen. (How would you like to live in a luxury flat, take your guests out onto the balcony, and then tell them “Do you know they found the first Ripper victim right there in the alley beside our car park?” Makes for interesting conversation! LOL Yep, one location is beside what used to be an old warehouse which has now been converted). Of course that's been nearly 11 years ago, so he's probably retired by now (he was middle-aged then), but if I was to take a tour again, I'd want it to be with someone like him.

I've been wondering about Norton's bio on Catherine Parr. I have it on my Amazon wish list but was waiting to hear some opinions. And I'd love to read a good bio on Anne of Cleves (who always seems to get the short shrift anyway).

Right now I have The Love Letters of Henry VIII and Norton's Margaret Beaufort bio enroute from Barnes & Noble!

I've got that one. Haven't read it yet!

Sharon said:

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A few years ago a tv show, Ghosthunters,  did a short about Jack.  Tina, it sounds like they did the tour you are talking about.  The guide explained how it had changed.  (If the movies are even a little accurate on what it looked like during Jack's time, it certainly has changed.) They showed the alley and the warehouse locations. 

I have to admit, I still watch the TV shows about this case. 

You and me both Sharon. And I love Ghosthunters. Sorry I missed that one. Did they show that church in Whitechapel where the prostitutes used to hang out? It's still there. I can't say I have a firm opinion on who did it because I've heard so many false rumors, innuendoes, etc. and then when I think I have actual evidence in front of me, someone else comes along and offers something new. And it didn't help that you had — I think — two police jurisdictions battling one another; even now, if jurisdictions don't cooperate, it can screw up a case, especially if you're dealing with a serial killer.

The first time I think I read a list of suspects was in the old Book of Lists which offered about ten of the more “logical” possibilities, including someone tied into the Salvation Army; one who came to America and as he was being hung allegedly started to say “I'm Jack the…” when the trap door fell out from under him….And of course Prince Albert “Eddie” Victor, the oldest son of Edward VII and Alexandra. That's the one that seems to fascinate most novelists, but I'm not sure how strong the actual evidence is. Ironically, I visited his ostentatious tomb in St. George's Chapel at Windsor. Didn't even realize who it was until I looked closer at the name and it hit me. That was also the same year I went on the Ripper tour, so I remember mentioning that to the friend who was traveling with me. I also remembered thinking that here was Henry VIII, Jane Seymour and Charles I memorialized with a concrete floor block and a possible Ripper suspect gets this tomb that was like something out of ancient Egypt! LOL Oh well.

Of course my all-time favorite suspect was The Entity. I know, I know, you're thinking “Huh?” That was the explanation they gave on the Original Star Trek in the episode Wolf in the Fold in which one of Kirk's officers is charged with Ripper type murders. They ended up figuring that the Ripper was something that lived and fed on fear (I think Spock, in one of the series' more chauvinistic comments said that it preyed on women because they scare easier LOL). It originally began on Earth, possibly as a human but never died, committing murders from the Ripper through 21st and 22nd century ones; then as human kind spread further into the galaxy, it packed its' bags and went with them. Interesting though.

What a coincidence. I did the Jack The Ripper Walking Tour last night!   Great fun.

TinaII2None said:

Wendy said:

What a coincidence. I did the Jack The Ripper Walking Tour last night!   Great fun.

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Okay now that IS a coincedence!! LOL I'm guessing you had a good time then!
 

I did it…mumble years ago…..

Anyanka said:

TinaII2None said:

Wendy said:

What a coincidence. I did the Jack The Ripper Walking Tour last night!   Great fun.

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Okay now that IS a coincedence!! LOL I'm guessing you had a good time then!

 

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I did it…mumble years ago…..
 

grrr! misssed the edit window.

I also have done the Ghost Walk in both York and Edinborough..

TinaII2None said:

 

You know what I've learned from this thread? I just never know when one thing will lead when we start discussing what we're reading or want to read. (Talk about a stream of consciousness). I've been in groups where — if you strayed even slightly from the main topic of the group — you were lucky you didn't find yourself banned; and of course you have some groups or lists that snipe at the slightest disagreement or love to flame the uninitiated. I still remember someone on a Titanic movie group who thanked me for not “screaming” at them for asking a question regarding the ship's engineering crew. I told them 'why would I scream at you for that when we're all supposed to be here to learn.' Well, at least that's the general idea anyway. I'm just smiling because in a week's time we've not only discussed books on the Tudors but Scarlett O'Hara and Jack the Ripper! (Oh and I think a side mention of Gerard Butler, Russell Crowe, Clark Gable, Errol Flynn and old radio shows!)

Gotta love this group!

most boards I'm on have a general talk thread. This thread seems to fulfill that need.

I've been on “Hive-Mind” boards before….goodness how some of those people survive in the real world escapes me.

My prefered style of board is where the admin/mods are part of the community, like this one. I hate ones where you can't speak out and ones where the admin is stilll on “Newbie” status and you only see them when posts are reported due to “cat-fights” or spam.

LOVE Ghosthunters and Ghosthunters International!!  I saw the episode where they went to Hellfire Caves and I vaguely remember them taking a JtR tour, and I think it was with the same guy who lead the tour when I took it in 2005ish.  

Very interesting how different that end of London is now compared to how it was during JtR's time.  I know that our tourguide pointed out the Prostitute's Church when I took the tour.  Basically, loitering wasn't allowed, so they would walk around the block, meet their johns on the backside if they had one, walk just fast enough on the front side to not be caught for loitering and possibly pick up another customer, and then do it all again.

I wouldn't want to be a prostitute during the best of times, but being one back then was just gross and rough.  

Sadly, the original ST was well after my time (I was born in 1981), but remain to this day a huge TNG and after fan.  I even liked Enterprise.

The worst boards I've ever been on have been Mommy boards.  People always wanting to, essentially, debate who's the better mom.  Who cares????  It was jusy unnecessarily maddening. 

Sharon said:

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I don't remember them showing the Church.  It was the episode where they went inside the Hellfire Caves.  

  So many theories.  I used to think it was the Prince along with his physician. Or someone else who studied anatomy, but then I thought I was giving the killer too much credit.  For the most part the guy was able to take his time with the women.  He became more creative with each victim.  The guy who came to America was another one I thought could have been the killer. I figured since the killings suddenly stopped in England, the killer very well could have jumped on a ship.  There was also a man who was under suspicion who had spent time in a mental institution, was released, or maybe he escaped, and if I remember correctly, he was picked up and returned to the hospital shortly after Mary was killed.

I must be the only one here who has never been to England.  Darn it.

I vaguely remember that ST episode.  Scotty was my favorite, too.  (Aside from Kirk.)  Interesting theory though.  BTW Did you see the 2009 ST movie with Chris Pine as Kirk?  I thought it was excellent and cannot wait to see the next one. 

This is the only forum I have ever been on.  I've heard many people say that other forums can be rude.  I seem to have picked the best one. I do enjoy our discussions.  We all have such varied interests, with varying opinions, and yet we always find common ground.  Like Gerard Butler, Russell Crowe, Errol Flynn, etc. 

Oh my mom told me about the one with the Hellfire Caves.
You're right about all the theories. Once we started talking about the Ripper, I went online and was checking out the information on the Prince; I didn't realize that the controversy started with a so-called factual book in the 1970's or 80's and then it all hit the fan, from supposed documentaries to fiction like From Hell and Murder by Decree. And seems the Prince wasn't even in London during a couple of the murders. Reminded me of Cromwell's allegations of where Anne supposedly committed adultery when the facts showed she was actually in other locations. I honestly don't know. I don't like seeing people slandered with minor things, let alone something as major as being Jack the Ripper. And while it doesn't sound like Prince Eddie was an angel, I don't know if he was the Ripper (sounds like some of the Prince Eddie hate began after his death and Queen Victoria possibly had some negative comments about her grandson as well).

I think I've heard of most of the suspects you mentioned. And sadly, the Ripper theories seem as plentiful as the JFK assassination ones.

Hey, YOU need to get to England!!

I DID see the Star Trek reboot and loved it! Looking forward to the sequel myself.

You're lucky about forums — and how great is it that the one you chose has been a fantastic experience.

And I agree with your last comment!!!!