Glad to find many other book geeks!

I just started reading 'The King's Daughter' by Sandra Worth about Elizabeth of York, wife to Henry VII and mother to Henry VIII

I just finished 'The White Queen', about Elizabeth's mother, Elizabeth Woodville, wife to Edward IV, great read. 

Boleynfan said:

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I agree with you too: it makes me angry as well. I forget where, but either here or in another thread, someone said they found a book claiming Anne was a vampire!! I mean, come on. Like you, I understand tweaks and even a little more than a tweak, but conjuring murders, witches, and vampires? Please.

On another note, a question: What is your favorite Tudor novel, everyone? I love Robin Maxwell's two and I, Elizabeth by Rosalind Miles.

I read that thread too. Can't remember which subject  it was under but the title of the thread was something like “Anne Boleyn Vampire.” Yes someone has written a fiction book in which Anne along with Mark Smeaton (and maybe George Boleyn — not sure why the other men who were executed got left out *rolls eyes*) sell their souls at the end and return as vampires, I'm guessing to seek bloody revenge on the Tudor court. (The Tudors Meet Twilight Meet Bram Stoker's Dracula.) I'm sure by the time it's all over with, half the court will be cursed, the other half will be dead, and someone like a Dr. Dee will become the Van Helsing of the tale and bring it all to an end, but not until utter carnage has occurred. (Okay — I won't even give them THAT much credit for creativity). Now for me, this is — again — going over the line. You are not creating some fictional character to make a vampire, or even using tradition (Dracula or that evil Elizabeth in Hungary who was a known mass murderer). You are taking real individuals, two of the mentioned dying in the Christian Faith (I'm basing this on their last words on the scaffold, and I'm afraid I don't know if Mark Smeaton was given that opportuniy), and then debasing them for yet another story in what is fast becoming a tiresome genre.

At least a ghostly Anne makes more sense. I read once that Britain had more ghosts per square mile (or was that square foot) than any nation on Earth, so Anne returning from the grave as a spirit is more sensible — and you've at least had people claiming to have seen her. (As well as numerous others from the Tudor era). If the author had written about Ghost Anne in the same manner of say that book that came out a few years ago and Peter Jackson made the movie version (the little girl who is murdered and is watching her family from Heaven), I might take it a little better. That was why I thought the Hauntings in the final episode of The Tudors was so powerful — Anne returning to see her daughter, the child we know would become the greatest of all the Tudors; Anne realizing that Henry did believe her guilty. Made more sense to me than some Vampire Anne Boleyn creeping around Hampton Court, sucking the life out of her enemies.  Okay — rant done (it's your fault Boleynfan for getting me going again ).

On a nicer note: my favorite Tudor novels? I have a fondness for I, Elizabeth but it's been years since I've read it. I enjoyed The Poyson Garden and The Tidal Poole, the first two entries in Karen Harper's Elizabeth Mysteries, only because it was nice to see a young Elizabeth featured in them. (The Poyson Garden also had her meeting an aged Mary Boleyn, her aunt, whom she knew little to nothing about; and in one, can't remember which, when she is at the Tower before her coronation, Elizabeth slips into St. Peter-ad-Vincula to secretly visit her mother's grave. I know that there's a moment when she whispers 'Mother — it's your Bess' that just went through me and had me in tears ). Didn't like book 3, The Twylight Tower and quit reading the series after that. I did like The Autobiography of Henry VIII, although I had to continually remind myself that it was all from Henry's POV, so him thinking Anne really was a witch drove me nuts. I remember liking The Secret Diary of Anne Boleyn by Maxwell, and a friend gave me Virgin: Prelude to the Throne; I don't remember what I thought of it now LOL I have mixed feelings towards Alison Weir's Elizabeth fic. But my first venture into Tudor fic was ages ago — and I can't remember the title!!!  It started when Elizabeth was very young and ended with her death; was written in third person; Elizabeth and Dudley finally made love when they were both middle-aged, and in one revealing moment, she angrily tells Cecil that she conceived a child by Seymour but it died. Sorry — brain fart.

And all of this makes me think of a topic that I need to see whether it's been covered before I became a member.  If not, I'd like to start a thread. Maybe some of you can tell me — have you all done one on your favorite (and least favorite) Tudor movie or TV portrayals?? Not the program or movie itself as much as the actor or actress. And I'm not just talking The Tudors themselves but the rest of the courtiers too.

Your post about those Amazon books made me literally speechless for five minutes, Tina112None. Oh my gosh. That is so completely crazy. Crazy. Crazy!! Don't worry about the rant–I'm really angry too. I just can't believe this! It is so infuriating. Those authors need to go and pick on someone else, not good people who were unfairly executed, may I add, as devout Christians with faithful speeches. I'm going to stop now, because if I don't, I will be ranting for pages!

I did read The Poyson Garden a few years ago, but can't remember much except it was a mystery–and didn't Elizabeth meet Mary Boleyn in a graveyard or something? Perhaps not, it could be my imagination since I've read so many Tudor novels since then. I liked the book a lot, but didn't realize it was part of a series! I think I'll re-read that and then read the rest of them. I haven't read Virgin: Prelude to the Throne–it's on my list though–but I have read Innocent Traitor, also by Alison Weir. Not my favorite; it was okay, not great. Still, I liked the character Jane Grey overall, so that was a plus. Thanks for replying so heartfeltedly, Tina112None!! I agree with everything you said.

Tina, I finally got to read, The Nonsuch Lure.  Thanks for the suggestion.  I enjoyed it very much.  I was going to order Crown in Candlelight if I could find it, but before I checked to see if it was available, I happened to be cleaning out some old books at my Mom's when I found a copy in the old bookcase.  It had to be mine since my Mom was not a reader.  I couldn't remember reading it , however, so I took it home and finally got around to it.  I loved it.  I do so enjoy reading that there were women around during that time period who actually married the men they loved. 

Another book about Catherine Valois which I enjoyed was, The Queen's Lover, by Vanora.  She had a tough childhood for a princess.

Speaking of old books, has anyone ever read, Fortune Made His Sword, by Martha Rofhart.  I don't know if you can even find it these days, but it is a fictional novel about Henry V.  I re-read this one at least every couple of years. Another really good one is Katherine, by Anya Seton. It is the story of Katherine Swynford, John of Gaunt's mistress and later his wife.  It too is fiction.  I have had a soft spot for her since I read these books in the early 70's. I just bought a newer edition, because my old one was falling apart from use.

Bella44 said:

Vampires should be put back in the coffin where they belong.  They were far more interesting when they were alternative and not part of the mainstream!  I was in my favourite bookstore this morning and I saw the Abraham Lincoln vampire hunter one.  Sheesh, is no historical figure sacred?!  Though your suggestion Tina about Winston Churchill has a certain ring to it….  But as for comparing someone who turns Elizabeth 1 into a vampire slayer with the likes of Tolkein and C S Lewis – wow, where does one begin?!

Tina – was the book about Elizabeth you mentioned called 'Legacy'?  Because it sounds an awful lot like it and it just so happens that that's my favourite fictional Tudor book.  If its not then I thoroughly recommend it – it's written by Susan Kay.  And no, I haven't read any of the book adaptations of 'The Tudors' but would like o know more too if someone has.

Has anyone read the Flavia De Luce series by Alan Bradley?  There's two of them so far, 'The Sweetness at the Bottom of the Pie' and 'The Weed That Strings the Hangmans Bag' and they're hilarious!  They're about an 11-year old girl living in the quintessential English village who solve murders, a sort of homage to classic murder-mysteries.

Legacy! That's it. Thank you so much Bella! I owned a hard copy of it when it was released; I have NO idea where it is now — I moved into my current apartment about 10 years ago, and regrettably, things (even my beloved books) got misplaced in transit. But that is most definitely it.  

I also owned a fictional book on Elizabeth that started not long after Mary became queen — found that one at a book sale and I definitely don't remember the title now. I didn't like it in the end as Elizabeth came across as coarse and in some instances, a deceiver. The one scene that rubbed me the wrong way was her telling Kat Ashley — during a “stomach bout” to get out of attending Mass — how much she disliked Mary, but most of all, pretending to like Anne of Cleves and most of all, Katherine Parr. She complains about translating some work for Katherine when she was a child, and having been tired of trying to please her stepmothers. I don't remember much else except that the book contained an image of Elizabeth as the goddess Diana — not sure if it was based on an actual portrait or not because I've never seen that one other than in that book. 

I was almost tempted to get the Abraham Lincoln one, but my better instincts kicked in. He's not only one of my favorite Presidents, but he was born in my home state (Kentucky), and I guess I just figure he deserves better than this. But like you, for Psychology Today to equate an author of a vampire slaying Elizabeth Tudor to the likes of Tolkien  — talk about putting your money where your mouth is!!!

I'd better watch it about Winston Churchill kicking major Nazi vampire butt. Someone might be listening (I've got dibs LOL).

You know, one of my favorite moments in a book about Elizabeth was not in fiction, but in one of my favorite Elizabeth biographies, and if you can find a copy of her Tudor trilogy, I highly recommend them (although so much more has been learned since her books were written in the Sixties and early Seventies). I'm talking about A Crown For Elizabeth by Mary M.  Luke, the middle book (Catherine, The Queen about Catherine of Aragon came first, and Glorianna was the last of the three). I'm pretty sure the scene makes an appearance in I, Elizabeth as well so it might have been inspired by that author reading A Crown For Elizabeth.

Ms. Luke writes of one of the few times when the Tudors seemed to be a real, functional family: it is a summer in Chelsea; Henry is married to Katherine Parr and in this last year or so of his life, he is surrounded by his children and his great-niece, Jane Grey. There are picnics and dancing; riding and childlike pursuits like dangling your feet in a lake or learning how to fish. And in the evenings, Henry regales the family with tales of his dashing youth. Ms. Luke speculates that in one of these moments, when the children are feeling very close to their father and overly relaxed, Elizabeth feels so comfortable with the King that she dares to innocently ask something about her mother. And is promptly sent away! (Ms. Luke says that there was some unknown incident in which the princess was shipped off and at the time, no one knew why. Ms. Luke gives some idea as to why it happened, and for me, it seemed somewhat reasonable). But the time away gives Elizabeth a chance to weigh what has happened, and how cautious she must be, especially as a royal daughter, and the mistake simply helps her to grow. Of course it was a historian's guess as to the circumstances, but she told it all so vividly that even now, that scene is almost more alive to me than any work of fiction.

Sharon said:

Tina, I finally got to read, The Nonsuch Lure.  Thanks for the suggestion.  I enjoyed it very much.  I was going to order Crown in Candlelight if I could find it, but before I checked to see if it was available, I happened to be cleaning out some old books at my Mom's when I found a copy in the old bookcase.  It had to be mine since my Mom was not a reader.  I couldn't remember reading it , however, so I took it home and finally got around to it.  I loved it.  I do so enjoy reading that there were women around during that time period who actually married the men they loved. 

Another book about Catherine Valois which I enjoyed was, The Queen's Lover, by Vanora.  She had a tough childhood for a princess.

Speaking of old books, has anyone ever read, Fortune Made His Sword, by Martha Rofhart.  I don't know if you can even find it these days, but it is a fictional novel about Henry V.  I re-read this one at least every couple of years. Another really good one is Katherine, by Anya Seton. It is the story of Katherine Swynford, John of Gaunt's mistress and later his wife.  It too is fiction.  I have had a soft spot for her since I read these books in the early 70's. I just bought a newer edition, because my old one was falling apart from use.

Sharon (hey — my best friend's name is also Sharon ) — I am SO glad you found The Nonsuch Lure and Crown in Candlelight and most of all, that you enjoyed them! I haven't read the latter in years, but that was what helped me to fall in love with Wales and the Welsh side of the Tudors. And it's been about 4 years since I've read The Nonsuch Lure so it's probably time again (I usually read it every few years). I might have to check out The Queen's Lover. I have such a soft spot for Catherine and Owen. I have seen the Seton novel pop up as a recommendation on Amazon, so this is another I may have to check on. Thanks!

Tina, OMG…Blaze Wyndham?  Author is Bertrice Small.  All of her books are a racy, very sexually explicit, but they are really interesting stories.  Historical/Romance. Not for everybody.  She did a series called, The Skye O'Malley Series.  They start out with Skye who becomes an Irish merchant turned pirate.  She raids English ships and runs afoul of Elizabeth many times.  The adventures this woman had are definitely jaw dropping.  The series is about Skye and her family.  

I'm not going to go into detail, but Ms. Small deals pretty much in fact when she writes about Elizabeth and other monarchs. I mean the historical stuff, not the sexual stuff.  I enjoyed all of her books.  In one of the books, Elizabeth's final days are accounted for by the author.  It was such a poignant chapter that I was compelled to look it up.  This was in my early days of falling in love with British historical figures.  Sure enough, the way she wrote it was exactly how most biographers say it happened. They were fun novels. 

Speaking of Pirates and O'Malleys, The Pirate Queen, by Alan Gold is an excellent story about Grace O'Malley, a real Irish Pirate, and Queen Elizabeth.  I have read a few books about Grace, but cannot recall the titles right now.  This  is one of the best.

I found Fortune Made His Sword on Amazon and bought myself a new copy.

Also found this if anyone is interested in Jacquetta and Elizabeth Wydville. http://www.susanhigginbotham.c…..  Jacquetta died in 1472.  Richard brought up the old charges in 1484.  She had been dead for 12 years.  I know there is a joke in there some where. 

Well, at least she deals in fact — I'd rather have that than someone who goes over the top to make things more sensational (hint-hint PG LOL).

So glad to find that someone else remembered Blaze Wyndham. I was starting to think I was the only one. Haven't read any of Ms. Small's other books but they sound interesting (I do know of the Skye O'Malley series though).  I think I got away from reading fiction about  the era because I like the stories about the court and those involved; I read one time travel romance and waited 300 pages for the hero and heroine to end up at Elizabeth's court, and the most I got in the end was a mention that the hero would do well at court because Elizabeth liked handsome men. That was it. LOL

So was Skye then inspired by Grace O'Malley?

Now that was interesting about Jacquetta. I wanted to find a joke in there for you too, but I'm tired — I've worked Overtime pretty much every day this week and the old brain's not functioning like it ordinarily would!

Sharon said:

Tina, OMG…Blaze Wyndham?  Author is Bertrice Small.  All of her books are a racy, very sexually explicit, but they are really interesting stories.  Historical/Romance. Not for everybody.  She did a series called, The Skye O'Malley Series.  They start out with Skye who becomes an Irish merchant turned pirate.  She raids English ships and runs afoul of Elizabeth many times.  The adventures this woman had are definitely jaw dropping.  The series is about Skye and her family.  

I'm not going to go into detail, but Ms. Small deals pretty much in fact when she writes about Elizabeth and other monarchs. I mean the historical stuff, not the sexual stuff.  I enjoyed all of her books.  In one of the books, Elizabeth's final days are accounted for by the author.  It was such a poignant chapter that I was compelled to look it up.  This was in my early days of falling in love with British historical figures.  Sure enough, the way she wrote it was exactly how most biographers say it happened. They were fun novels. 

Speaking of Pirates and O'Malleys, The Pirate Queen, by Alan Gold is an excellent story about Grace O'Malley, a real Irish Pirate, and Queen Elizabeth.  I have read a few books about Grace, but cannot recall the titles right now.  This  is one of the best.

I found Fortune Made His Sword on Amazon and bought myself a new copy.

Also found this if anyone is interested in Jacquetta and Elizabeth Wydville. http://www.susanhigginbotham.c…..ville.html  Jacquetta died in 1472.  Richard brought up the old charges in 1484.  She had been dead for 12 years.  I know there is a joke in there some where.